May 7 2007Spider-Man to Fight Carnage, Lizard, Apathy

I braved the opening night crowd to see '3' on Friday and I can safely say that if they did make a Spider-Man 4, it would only be because its a huge cash cow right now or to develop the only lingering storyline that's left to explore and that is: The Lizard Man (just like you said in your post.)

I said before I saw part 3, no movie franchise that I know of in history has EVER gone past the trilogy point and still been successful, at least in the fans eyes. Although I do believe Spider Man does have that potential. Even though I never liked Sandman as a villian from back in the comics and the FOX cartoon show, it was good in the movie.

So here's my prediction for S P I D E R - M A N 4!

Main Villian: Mysterio (but not a gay ass outfit like in the cartoon)
Sub-Villian: Lizard Man
At the end maybe hint towards Carnage.

Honestly, it sounded good in my head but after writing it down just now, maybe it is better that they stop while they're ahead. All the conflicts seem resolved?!

I took my wife and daughter to watch Spider-Man 3 this past Friday and while I will gladly admit that I have been hugely excited to see this for about 2 or 3 months now, I got preflight jitters, so to speak.

Fear set in as I had worries and doubts that one of the more entertaining comic book properties to hit film would go the path of X-Men 3 and either have too much story to cram into an hour and forty-five minutes or just lose it by having a less-than-amazing script to follow up on the last 2 pictures. With a dance scene that gave little to the story's progression and the introduction of some great and important characters that weren't, in my opinion, given enough screen time to grow, to be honest, it walked the X3 path for about an hour and a twenty minutes.

The saving grace came when a lot of loose ends were tied together very well (with exception to Sandman's ultimate fate that I found to be a little too relaxed), the set up of great follow up potential for other films, and an ending that was so fanboy cool it really amazed me when compared to the last 2 movies and with the X franchise. All things considered, I really enjoyed the movie and felt it was a fitting wrap for the trilogy.

Now, as for a fourth installment, I can't wait for it. I know the whole cast and crew are on the fence at this point but I'm still excited about the possibility of more Spider-Man films being done. It is a great cash cow, you can't take a step through a store of any kind without seeing something adorned by a spider or a web, but it's also a great family movie that has just enough of an adult feel for me as a geeky comic book fan to enjoy it and not feel more like a geek when talking about it to my non-comic book loving friends.

As for the villains, Carnage was always a favorite of mine but i think it may be too soon to give him the spotlight. I think the debut of the Lizard is long overdue. Not the 'Lizard Man,' but the Lizard, Dr. Curt Conners. My personal picks for the fourth film's villains would be the Lizard and Kraven as the main villains of the film and to hype Kraven as an equal to Spider-Man, I'd toss in some of Spidey's animal based rogues for he and Kraven to fight over, as villains to thwart for Spider-Man and trophies for Kraven. It'd be great to see characters like the Rhino and Beetle or the Vulture, maybe even Puma or Tarantula if you want to use some real obscurities as fodder for the main feud.

Another thing I would do in the fourth film is remove Mary Jane from the New York. Hell, I wouldn't bring her back until the end of part 5. This would give the Gwen Stacy/Peter Parker romance time to grow and offer some change for the fans.

I've read similar ideas on other sites but since watching the movie myself but it really makes the most sense in terms of story progression. Kraven offers Spider-Man someone to make him feel unnecessary and not wanted, Kraven would steal away his spotlight. Lizard would be a great addition to the scientific end of Spider-Man's life in the films and serve as some small drama with the whole betrayal of a friend angle. Allow Gwen Stacy to become an important part of Parker's life and build that up for a possible death scene in the next movie.

Obviously, I have my ideas for a fourth Spider-Man movie and even an idea or two for a fifth. But until they royally destroy the franchise by introducing the Clone Saga, I'll still be a fan and I'll still be excited for the next installment.

aww hell no

I was into the latest Spider-Man most of the way through, even though sometimes it was kind of train-wreck entertaining. I loved the black spiderman angle, up until it got ridiculous during the dance scene.

The last 20 minutes definitely sucked though. And I'm not a huge fan of Sandman as a villain because he doesn't really makes sense. Doc Ock was cartoony, but he didn't stretch the bounds of logic nearly as much Sandman does. The first one was mediocre at best, the second one was great, and this one's somewhere in between.

A question for Jonathon Wagers. So by adding the vulture, kraven, etc. are you wanting the spiderman franchise to be like Batman & Robin? I agree with Vince (4th post), Sandman was never a good idea for a villian. Neither was Green Goblin but they made it believable. Doc Oc was the most believable out of all the villians thus far.

Those other characters are great but some are simply meant for cartoons and not motion picture live adaptations. While movies are supposed to let us escape from reality for a few hours, their still needs to be a bit of realism to them. And the only thing I can think of to drive a nail into the Spidey franchise's coffin faster is a man dressed up in a rhinosaurus outfit!

I still say SPIDERMAN 4: Either Lizard or Mysterio.

Well, for a long time there, rumors were heavily circulating about Mysterio being a fourth villain in Spiderman 3. He could have been scrapped for another sequel later down the road.

I'm not gonna lie, I haven't liked ANY of the Spiderman movies yet, especially considering that there are some pretty quality villains from the comics and cartoons. Morbius? Carnage? Lizard? Scorpion? Come to think of it, there are a ton of animals in this world, why not have a crossover where Spidey needs help from, say, Wolverine? Or the Avengers against the Sinister Twelve?

If done well, Spiderman could continue to rake in the cash. I'm still shocked it's made this much money, since the movies so far have sucked SO MUCH. We'll see if they can continue without the tools in charge.

I think that the Lizard and Kraven would be amazing! It would make so much sense. A "lizard-man" is seen in the streets of New York, and who better to capture these beast the TV's most famous hunter (if you go with the ultimate story line) than Kraven the Hunter!!! Or course Kraven will only use this as an excuse to capture his real prey, Spider-Man.

In reply to Conor:
It would suck so much for the franchise to go the way of the original Bat flicks but I didn't mean to use the animal based villains as main characters but more as asides for some much needed action. Like Nick said, they could take the Ultimate route and make Kraven more of a reality TV star and have him tracking all these minor threat villains as a means to build steam and popularity in the public eye for when he tries to tackle Spider-Man. Perhaps Kraven is actually responsible for the bad guys running around, except for the Lizard, and that could add to his potential threat level.

And Rhino could be done better than just a rhino suit, the Ultimate Rhino has more of a cybernetic feel than just spandex and would translate well to film if done right. I think that most if not all of the animal based villains that fans may actually want to see in the movies could be translated over to film very well and with some realism if done right. Most of them are just guys in robotic suits anyway and most are more believable than the Green Goblin suit was made to be.

I really don't understand what the big deal is with Mysterio. I thought his best moment ever was the end to the Guardian Devil storyline in Daredevil where he delivers that cool speech followed by putting a bullet in his own brain. How can a giant fishbowl-headed man in purple and green wearing a cape translate to film wihtout looking plain dumb? At least Kraven had a definitive story in Kraven's Last Hunt.

Just to let everyone know, I can't stand the character of Kraven but I think his inclusion to a movie based on the Lizard just makes sense in regards to story progression. Honestly, I'd love to see a movie centered on the Maximum Carnage story and something with the Sinister Six. Hell, I joked about it earlier but I wouldn't mind to see how Sam Raimi and company would handle a serious take on the Clone Saga.

I'm telling you, Kraven and the Lizard in the 4th, maybe Venom and Carnage in the fifth, and then you bring them all back for Spider-Man: Sinister 6. How bad ass would that be?

In response to Jonathons response to me:
I totally get your point with the whole, who is going to take a guy with a giant fish bowl on his head seriously debate, which is why if Mysterio were to be the next big villian...there would have to be some SERIOUS costume revamping!

Even though the Ultimate Rhino does look a hell of a lot better than the traditional spandex one, I'd personally have to vote no on a rhino based spidey.
And apparently '3' took in 148 Million this weekend alone and I also heard that the studio plans on making a 4,5,6 and 7?!! I don't know how true this is or if it was just a spur of the moment comment by the studio but this SERIOUSLY scares me! It's obviously been seen as a 'cash cow' now and you know how Hollywood gets when that happens!

If a spidey movie is made without the crucial cast,director,etc. then it more than likely will suck. Look at X3. Even though it was pretty good, it just lacked. One last opinion, the spiderman franchise doesn't have enough good bad guys to make it to 7, I think.

they should just purge maguire and dunst and start fresh.. couldn't have found a couple of people less suited for these roles. ugh

so far I'm really enjoying NOT seeing Spider-Man 3, I bet not seeing Spider-Man 4 will be even more satisfying.

To Conor:
I agree with you for the most part. And I'm not saying Mysterio couldn't be done but it would be a stretch as far as being believable unless they did some major costume tweaking and then the fan outcry would be worse than when they changed the Green Goblin look. Basically on that front, no one would be happy with Mysterio as a major villain unless Bruce Campbell played him. And even that would be a little too campy for me.

I agree that announcing up to a 7th film alrerady is not only a little premature to assume the franchise is bulletproof but also a little overzealous. Considering the history of comic book films, the third in a trilogy and anything beyond that is usually a flop. They scraped by with 3 so they'll have to pull some amazing stuff to make 4 based on Carnage a big hit for any other reason than being a cash cow. I can see there being a 7th movie but they are really going to need to work the story out better than they did with 3 and flesh out main characters that people are going to want to see.

While I felt sorry for Sandman's tragedy and familial struggle, I couldn't have given an extra crap about him after those initial scenes of set-up. Eddie Brock just came out out of nowhere and then we were supposed to choke him down as a main character introduced late in the film. Gwen's part was almost a throwaway. Captain Stacy was done pretty well and Curt Connor's inclusion was a nice touch. But what happened to John Jameson? It would have made perfect sense for the returning astronaut to bring the symbiote to Earth but instead he was completely dropped and forgotten.

My gripe with Spider-Man 3 is that the new characters were kind of shoved in our faces and we were expected to accept them with no problem. Things like this are what kills a franchise, especially one with as much potential as the Spider-Man movies.

And I like the Ultimate Rhino way better than the original but I wouldn't place either in the position of a main villain. Though I do think he and Vulture would make for some cool on screen visuals and make for some interesting fights scenes with either Spidey or Kraven.

Jon,

I liked Spidey 3 because it was a pretty good end to a trilogy even though it was a bit of plot/storyline overkill. The fight scenes though I thought were great but I totally agree with your stance on how the venom symbiote should've come from John Jamesons flight returning to orbit. In addition, I agree that some of the villians/people were 'thrown in our faces' and we were just supposed to except it. I think you pinpointed the very downfall of previous action hero movies my friend!

I hope they stick to the one main villain formula. Lizard would be interesting.

Thanks, Conor, my friend. I was afraid for a minute or two that our discussion was going to turn ugly but but I'm glad we could both be adult about it and appreciate each other's points. The more I think about it, the less I find Rhino to be as appealing onscreen.

To Col:
I would like to have seen a Spidey flick dedicated to the Venom symbiote myself but I think the franchise is already pushed it too far to bring the villain quota back to one per film. I would love to see it but it would take a really strong villain to take the spotlight for a whole movie.

And on a personal note, and I mean this in complete sarcasm, who besides me can't wait to see the introduction Hydro Man? Or was it just Hydro? He sucks so bad I can't really be bothered to remember his actual name. But the Lizard is just the Lizard and not Lizard Man.

i want to see carnage figting spiderman.mysterio no. mabe even see venom fight carnage at the end

i want to see carnage figting spiderman.mysterio no. mabe even see venom fight carnage at the end

i think carnage should come in spidey 4 he looks so sweet but i think its going to be mysterio, not lizard, hes gay!

I think that carnage should have been in spiderman 3 because venom and him could have good partners to fight spiderman. But in spiderman 4 carnage turns against venom and defeats venom and siderman and is feared forever mwa ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha I hate spiderman and love carnage.....

yeah about Mysterio that kind of character is just to hard to convert from comic to live-action.
And i was wondering will they ever make a hero vs. hero spin-off movie?